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NeoGeo64
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« on: July 17, 2016, 01:34:56 pm »

What will OA look like in a few years from now?  Are there any new ideas, weapons, stages or features in the works?  I love OA!
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Gig
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« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2016, 03:13:03 pm »

Future of OA will be OA3:
(DO NOT LINK) h t t p s : / / openarena . wikia . com/wiki/OA3
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« Reply #2 on: July 17, 2016, 04:55:40 pm »

It still won't be "next gen" if that's what you're getting at.
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asking when OA3 will be done won't get OA3 done.
Progress of OA3 currently occurs behind closed doors alone

I do not provide technical support either.

new code development on github
Neon_Knight
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« Reply #3 on: July 17, 2016, 05:28:36 pm »

Mainly there will be a huge cutout of content. To give you an idea, the following will be trimmed or redone:
- Maps which make OA to look bad. They will either be given a better look and run well or be removed entirely.
- "Cover"/"Tribute" maps. (Maps with layouts inspired in other games, i.e. q3dm6ish, oa_dm*, dm4ish/dm6ish...) These will be sent to a separate package.
- Characters. They will either be redone or removed.

The page Gig linked should serve as reference.
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Gig
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« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2016, 12:46:56 am »

About "new" weapons you asked, they will be "new" in design only, but their behavior will be the same. Altering core Quake3 gameplay falls under DO NOT LINK[/b]) h t t p s : / / openarena . wikia . com/wiki/NOTTODO]NOTTODO.
There will be a revamped UI and some new graphic effects (e.g. particle-based explosions)...
AFAIK, no new gametypes are plannet yet... maybe, if someone may take care of coding it, Possession gametype may fit.
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« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2016, 01:30:16 am »

i'd love to make new gametypes, i just have this feeling i'd muck up more things in the process if i try though

i had catch the chickenpilfer the fowl, enviromental last man standing, and a couple of monster-involved gametypes in mind (monster hunt and dmsp/invasion). and assault (the permanently open doors are in at least, which is basic steps towards it).
« Last Edit: July 18, 2016, 01:33:12 am by fromhell » Logged

asking when OA3 will be done won't get OA3 done.
Progress of OA3 currently occurs behind closed doors alone

I do not provide technical support either.

new code development on github
Gig
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« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2016, 05:42:56 am »

Oh right, now I see the OA3 wiki page mentions "more game types", but for some reason, that is written under the DO NOT LINK[/b]) h t t p s : / / openarena . wikia . com/wiki/OA3#GUI]GUI section of the page...

And I forgot about Fromhell's "monsters" idea. Oops.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2016, 01:37:04 am by Gig » Logged

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Neon_Knight
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« Reply #7 on: July 18, 2016, 06:36:57 am »

I remember a past user of this forum saying that there's a limit for both numbers of weapons and gametypes (16 IICR); can't remember how he was called, I remember him being one of the banned ones for deleting his own posts.

Perhaps the Missionpack can be reused for the monster-based gametypes?
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Gig
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« Reply #8 on: July 18, 2016, 07:28:49 am »

I fear adding many more gametypes could hit some problems like making arenas.txt file too big (IIRC, Sago said enlarging its max size would break mod compatibility) or some cvars becoming too long (as the one which specifies mappools -auto rotation- cfg files for all gametypes)...

Maybe creating additional gametypes as a cumulative mod, as NK suggested, may be an acceptable workaround.

However, I feel we would need at least one more non-team-based gametype in baseoa.
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Neon_Knight
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« Reply #9 on: July 18, 2016, 09:52:54 am »

For an extra non-team based gametype we should have Q3R's Possession.
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fromhell
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« Reply #10 on: July 18, 2016, 03:45:09 pm »

that's literally catch the chicken sans chicken. Q3R even had an actual Catch the Chicken planned (there's still a cluck and a few "chicken" level gametype headers in the files)
« Last Edit: July 18, 2016, 04:09:58 pm by fromhell » Logged

asking when OA3 will be done won't get OA3 done.
Progress of OA3 currently occurs behind closed doors alone

I do not provide technical support either.

new code development on github
Gig
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« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2016, 01:08:02 am »

Years ago I tested DO NOT LINK[/b]) h t t p s : / / openarena . wikia . com/wiki/ModCompat/Q3_Catch_the_Chicken]Q3 Catch the Chicken mod in OA.

While the main goal is the same (keep an item as long as possible to score points), that mod had some differences from Q3R Possession which made it a different gametype: the chicken moves around the arena (the Possession flag just spawns in different places), the chicken releases golgen eggs with powerups, and more importantly players not having the chicken are invulnerable and the one having it cannot shoot.

Having to choose only one between the two, I (IMHO) would opt for Possession for the following reasons:
- Catch the Chicken can already be achieved by using the old Q3 mod. At the time I tested it (OA 0.8.5) there was a problem with a shader for the golden egg, but otherwise it seemed okay. One may just test in OA3 that shader works as expected.
- OpenArena replicated game mechanics of Q3 franchise, and Q3 Revolution is part of the franchise, so integrating something from Q3R has got sense. Possession gamecode is not GPL'd and so we have to code it from scratch, but it does not sound harder than other gametypes. Simpler gametype may mean fewer new bugs.
- Although more original and complex, chasing a chicken sounds less "serious" than holding a flag, and this -still IMHO- sounds a bit more adapt for a mod than for the base game.
However, it's your game and we still have to find someone available for coding a new gametype...
« Last Edit: July 19, 2016, 01:34:55 am by Gig » Logged

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Neon_Knight
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« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2016, 07:22:06 am »

Not to mention that for Possession we wouldn't need to create any new assets, as we can simply reuse the white flag from 1FCTF for the objective itself.
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sago007
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« Reply #13 on: July 19, 2016, 09:23:40 am »

FFA gametypes I could imagine.

Possesion. Seems easy enough:
If no white flag spawn a white flag at a domination point. If no domination point spawn at a player spawn.
For every second the white flag is held then score a point.
If whiteflag is in a nodrop zone then remove it. (will trigger respawn)
If the player holding it leaves, remove the flag (if not dropped)


FFA King of the hill
Score a point for every two seconds being near the white flag
A flag can give 30 points before despawning
The white flag cannot be taken
Whiteflags spawns randomly at domination points.

If no one else is working on it I think I can get the Possesion done in a couple of days. At least so that it can be started from the console. If I remember correctly it is adding it to the menu that is painful.

Possesion can possible be upgraded to Catch the chicken later.
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Gig
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« Reply #14 on: July 19, 2016, 10:08:27 am »

If no one else is working on it I think I can get the Possesion done in a couple of days. At least so that it can be started from the console. If I remember correctly it is adding it to the menu that is painful.
That would be GREAT!!!!  Smiley Smiley Smiley

Maybe, before you start working on it, you may wish to give a quick look to the existing thread about it:
http://openarena.ws/board/index.php?topic=3995.0
Here it is a specific post of yours where you did a sort of "to-do" list for implementing Possession: http://openarena.ws/board/index.php?topic=3995.msg36671#msg36671

PS: don't forget to make the white flag spawn in other kinds of spawn points (team spawn points and/or ffa spawn points) in case it does not find a DOM point.* This mode should work with all maps!
I don't even know if it should check for dom/flag spawn points first or if it should directly go for team/ffa spawn points. And do you think it should automatically change spawn point in case noone finds it in some time? I mean, surely after some times it has been dropped, but also after some time it spawned (a longer time maybe)?

PPS: I don't remember if Q3R had it, however maybe some sort of text (or graphics or audio beep, but I suppose a distance indicator in game units may be the simper one) indicator which tells you if you are going closer or farther than the flag (like the beep in DO NOT LINK[/b]) h t t p s : / / openarena . wikia . com/wiki/ModCompat/Hunt]"save the universe" mode of "Hunt" Q3 mod) may be useful.
I don't even remember if Q3R Possession had a key to drop the flag or not. Probably not, but I'm not really sure.

PPPS: Sorry for adding so many thoughts to this post. I can guess we should continue in the apposite Possession idea thread. UPDATE: Just rewritten these thoughts of mine there.

* Re-reading your post, I see you already said "If no domination point spawn at a player spawn". It looks like the first time I did not notice it, and confused that line with the line about domination points for King of the Hill, where you did not specify the fallback rule. Sorry.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2016, 01:35:34 am by Gig » Logged

I never want to be aggressive, offensive or ironic with my posts. If you find something offending in my posts, read them again searching for a different mood there. If you still see something bad with them, please ask me infos. I can be wrong at times, but I never want to upset anyone.
Neon_Knight
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« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2016, 05:58:10 pm »

I suppose that King-of-the-Hill-like maps can be done without the need of another gametype. There's already the target_score entity, which gives points to whoever triggers it.
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3xcl4m4t10n
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« Reply #16 on: September 22, 2016, 05:01:55 pm »

Hello!

Im new around here, nice to meet everybody! I am interested on OA3 but all the links on the Wiki article send to nowhere, Is the project cancel or it is just I can't access to that information? If it still going, Is there anyway to keep updated with the last news?
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« Reply #17 on: September 22, 2016, 05:13:23 pm »

It's not cancelled.  It's just that Gig is spoiling everything not realizing about how private the forums are and potentially misleading (yay counterproductivity).  and there's no real news to show because I can't animate good or make good weapon models to the point of a single, concrete, representative screenshot. it's just me in the 3d art department and creative mapping (i.e. not rehashes of old maps) department right now

BUT IF YOU REALLY WANT TO KNOW WHAT'S OA3'S STATUS IS!!!!

10 female player models, 6 ingame (with bad animations)
0 male player models, 0 ingame
1 it player models, 1 ingame (with worse animations)
7 weapon models, only 3 look great, 1 looks remotely ok
map progress unknown (I have ~5 maps going at once at least)
0 songs
51mb LZMA-compressed size


and if you really want to know the OA3 forum really is like, it's really years of outdated information and concepts.  I only regularly post in the WIPwipwipwipwp thread there with screenshots of wip assets which barely get feedback if any ay all (think "good work").  and just now there's finally testing of prominently public engine features i've implemented 2 years ago, which is not exactly inspiring confidence to put out betas, even privately. Even having new OA3 UI scripts/assets made public didn't produce anything in response for years. (ok, there was one favorite to a tweet but that's as most it ever got)
« Last Edit: September 22, 2016, 06:14:24 pm by fromhell » Logged

asking when OA3 will be done won't get OA3 done.
Progress of OA3 currently occurs behind closed doors alone

I do not provide technical support either.

new code development on github
Gig
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« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2016, 01:50:20 am »

It's not cancelled.  It's just that Gig is spoiling everything not realizing about how private the forums are and potentially misleading (yay counterproductivity).
Excuse me, what are you referring to? I'm not the one who wrote the DO NOT LINK[/b]) h t t p s : / / openarena . wikia . com/wiki/OA3]OA3 wiki page, I did only minor changes to it (e.g. adding a note to mention that some of the links in that page bring to the restricted OA3 section of the forum).
Some oa3 wiki pages, like DO NOT LINK[/b]) h t t p s : / / openarena . wikia . com/wiki/OA3List]OA3List, have been created by you, so it looks like you thought they were a good idea back then. I suppose they may still be useful, if someone could update them...
So, what are you referring to? Where am I spoiling? Because I provide feedback about new features such as Possession gametype or other gamecode changes in their apposite threads which are outside from the restricted OA3 sections? If that's the case, you can move those threads (or create new ones) to the OA3 section, if you wish.
Or maybe because I recently used a wiki "sandbox" page of mine (under "user:" namespace, not in main namespace... and not linked anywhere else than from my own user page) to keep some kind of trace for OA3 changes, to know what to write when OA3 will come out? If that's the case, how to keep trace about that? The forum is not adapt because posts cannot be updated after some time. Maybe it is somehow possible to "hide" a wiki page so only admins can access it? However, I don't think a page like my the one in my sandbox can harm the project in any way... and there is also a note there which says that what those features may be subject to changes.

Quote
I only regularly post in the WIPwipwipwipwp thread there with screenshots of wip assets which barely get feedback if any ay all (think "good work").
Excuse me, what more can be said about a video or a screenshot of a character? If there was a pk3 to test the character, one may provide feedback such as "swim animation is broken", but otherwise, what can someone say more than "nice"? Would you like feedback like "make her hair longer" or "make the hat grey"? If you are uncertain about something, feel free ask "Guys, do you think her hair is okay or should I make it longer?", otherwise an artist just express his(her) art...

Quote
Even having new OA3 UI scripts/assets made public didn't produce anything in response for years.
IIRC, when someone asked if OA3 UI was available for testing, some years ago you said it was still lacking too much things to be usable... and then we haven't had any statements saying the opposite, so for what we know it was still unusable. What about something like "okay guys, it's 75% finished, you can test it now"? But, unlike gamecode and engine, which have recently been packaged automatically with "nightly builds", there is no download package for OA3 UI.
Just making sources available on Github does not really allow people to provide feedback. Not everyone is capable of compiling this stuff on their own, not everyone is comfortable with id tech 3 and C language.

Also, "OA3 development discussions must be kept restricted to a few users only, and new features should not be revealed" and "sources are available to everyone, why doesn't people from all the world provide feedback about new features?" ideas seem in conflict each other, from my personal point of view.
I'm not sure about this "keep secret" thing, however you are the project leader and I'll try to follow your indications... but please give us some coherent indications about how to work. I want to help the project, for the little that I can, and I don't want to upset you in any way...

Please correct me where I'm wrong, but calmly and clearly. You know, I'm somewhat slow to comprehend at times, you have to be a bit patient with me.  Smiley


PS: I assumed you used "spoling" like "spoilers" for movies or tv series (something like "leaking")... in case you meant something worse (e.g. "ruining the game"), please explain better. Although even "leaking" has got limited sense, considering that source code is public... And a story-less game is not a movie....
« Last Edit: September 26, 2016, 03:34:31 pm by Gig » Logged

I never want to be aggressive, offensive or ironic with my posts. If you find something offending in my posts, read them again searching for a different mood there. If you still see something bad with them, please ask me infos. I can be wrong at times, but I never want to upset anyone.
3xcl4m4t10n
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« Reply #19 on: September 26, 2016, 07:02:39 am »

Thank you all for all the information. From my point of view it seems like the project lacks of transparency (it is weird because it is an opensource project) and responsability. Don't miss understand my words, I am not saying there is a guilty or blamming someone Smiley.

It is just how I feel it Cheesy.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2016, 07:08:32 am by 3xcl4m4t10n » Logged
fromhell
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« Reply #20 on: September 26, 2016, 07:34:12 pm »

Probably the most publicly arty thing for OA3 that's occured on this board is this thread which has a bunch of concepts that i'm modeling many of (but not all.  The borderline nude ones are off the table)

however that doesn't cover my own designs which I try to do on my own, like the upcoming lamia player which nicely suits the new art style i'm heading for.  Nice colors, just the right amount of detail, one surface, no alphas or shader effects, and a shapely design that's easily decimatable to lower poly versions



but the real problem is the apathy.  I'm not exactly making the "desired" promode glowing playerblob fest, and the plan with the anime style is so that it's clear enough it doesn't have to be with all these big heads, eyes, and hair rummaging around maps at high speed. I don't have much community support for this idea since the game they have is already done and content with big green grism polygons on the q3wctf paks.

There's also the unusual graphics snobbery in communities expecting some sort of normalmapped deferred screenspacereflectioneverywhere world on a new game in 2016 for free which is highly demotivating (and point missing).  I've been suggested so many engine swtiches on the basis of graphics technology from "ideas persons" (some of which administrate entire communities who play graphically-juiced favorites in bias), it's not even funny anymore.  It's like i've never been 'enlightened' by Torque3D, id Tech4, or anything else that can use a shader program in an engine before.


(and before there's FUD over new designs hitting the female armor bingo cards, I do have a plan.)
« Last Edit: September 26, 2016, 09:25:51 pm by fromhell » Logged

asking when OA3 will be done won't get OA3 done.
Progress of OA3 currently occurs behind closed doors alone

I do not provide technical support either.

new code development on github
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