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Author Topic: Some questions regarding character design contribution  (Read 274 times)
ELR1C_C150utcast
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« on: January 15, 2018, 02:42:05 am »

Greetings! I was kinda compelled to help out with contributing some character designs but i'm kinda stuck with a number of questions before i proceed. Also to clarify, i'm more or less a novice character designer or digital artist in general, and am still in the process of learning how to use 3D modeling programs and maybe a little programming and coding here and there, so it may be some time before I can be any significant help to you guys with making the models and stuff.  So... Here goes ^_^;

1) In the Open Arena Wiki, there's a list of 'To do'  character designs that don't seem to be implemented yet... Should the designs i make of the ones in the to do list end up in the current build of Open Arena (it they get permitted or validated into the roster or something) Or should they end up in the OpenArena 3 release version instead?

2)If i make a redesign of an existing character (i.e. Beret with a more Vietnam War era look or a more Gulf War era look ) and assuming it gets validated as a skin for that existing character, will it end up in the current build or OpenArena 3 release version instead?

3)Is there a committee that approves character designs, and are there any particular rubrics that i need to abide by whilst making the design? I did remember reading in either the wiki or somewhere  here in the forums that  any designs that are too reminiscent of Q3 or is copyrighted or uses too much "gritty realistic"   boring colors or designs  and even something about Lovercraftian type designs or something are not what the devs are looking for (and yup, no obscene or nsfw or political stuff in either... Theres enough of that clogging up in the internet so i'm glad the people working on this game agree lol ) But are there any other specific things in the design that i should add or remove?

I guess having typed all 3 questions i came to realize that the last one was a bit vague and is very context sensitive and the first 2 questions are almost essentially the same, but i guess If i end up stuck somewhere or curious, i'll just maybe add more questions here or look for a more proper thread for asking questions of this matter?  Eitherway, many thanks to the people and community here for working on and contributing in this awesome open source arena shooter! I guess I'll gush more about this project later in a more appropriate thread or something, but thanks again  nonetheless Smiley

-ELDR1C_C150utcast... You can also call me Eldric, or Elric... Or Nick!
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Gig
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« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2018, 03:39:31 am »

Hello Nick, welcome!  Smiley

Are you referring to http://openarena.wikia.com/wiki/Character_ideas ?

That page keeps some generic ideas for characters left by various people, not only real "requests" from the project leader... it's not said that if someone will made one of such characters, it will end up in some official release. Also, probably much of that list was written before the OA3 guidelines...

Of course, you can try to make your own character and, after it's fully completed and tested, ask for its inclusion through the SVN commits thread... it will be Fromhell, the project leader, to decide.

If you wish to make a character for an official OA release, you should aim for OA3 standards (anime-ish style), as no more OA 0.x patches are scheduled.

About making additional skins for OA 0.x characters, of course you can do them and "publish" them on your own... but most OA 0.x characters will be reworked or replaced with someone else in OA3, so skins designed for OA 0.x will probably not fit OA3 models.

I hope Fromhell may give you better infos about what she needs...
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« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2018, 02:01:51 pm »

1) I consider the wiki unofficial and only useful for information/guide purposes only.   Creative direction happens off-site (and usually in a private forum where it'll be ignored by those with access to it anyway).

Currently the OA3 cast is a bunch of my own designs (dark elves, lamias etc) plus select Arne's designs contributed from this thread which helped my creative block massively.  Then I model/texture them, and attempt to animate them (since animating a player model is a very lost art) in which no one helps at all and they rot on my hard drive until i'm ready.  I also have to try and find the spare time and motivation for doing this.

2) Not always a guarantee.  Many of the redesigns are hugely technical (i.e. one 24-bit texture surface) and conform to a new art direction which will need their proportions exaggerated and their skin detail somewhat simplified (no grainy bits etc) and conforming to the split model standard, so no more Angelyss  entire-figure-is-a-lower-model-for-the-slingshot-bikini-to-not-be-broken-and-jiggle-physics trick etc.

3) It's usually just me filtering the designs out by laying concepts out on some grid and seeing if something sticks out.  OA3's general inspiration is high fantasy / tech mix, akin to Phantasy Star, which I feel isn't done in FPSes much and would compliment the fast gameplay the most and brings the most varied of map themes (and sense).

Of course, you can try to make your own character and, after it's fully completed and tested, ask for its inclusion through the SVN commits thread... it will be Fromhell, the project leader, to decide.

Don't mislead into futile development.  I don't even have a SVN client installed for years anymore given how creatively dried up the scene is...
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 02:16:33 pm by fromhell » Logged

asking when OA3 will be done won't get OA3 done.
Progress of OA3 currently occurs behind closed doors alone

I do not provide technical support either.

new code development on github
ELR1C_C150utcast
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« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2018, 03:21:59 am »


Hello Nick, welcome!  Smiley

Are you referring to http://openarena.wikia.com/wiki/Character_ideas ?

That page keeps some generic ideas for characters left by various people, not only real "requests" from the project leader... it's not said that if someone will made one of such characters, it will end up in some official release. Also, probably much of that list was written before the OA3 guidelines...

Of course, you can try to make your own character and, after it's fully completed and tested, ask for its inclusion through the SVN commits thread... it will be Fromhell, the project leader, to decide.

If you wish to make a character for an official OA release, you should aim for OA3 standards (anime-ish style), as no more OA 0.x patches are scheduled.

About making additional skins for OA 0.x characters, of course you can do them and "publish" them on your own... but most OA 0.x characters will be reworked or replaced with someone else in OA3, so skins designed for OA 0.x will probably not fit OA3 models.

I hope Fromhell may give you better infos about what she needs...

Many thanks for the clarifications and suggestions Gig!

I kinda got stuck because prior to typing my questions  and waay before choosing to sign up to the forums, i remembered somewhere on the wiki reading about OpenArena 3 and that is was still being put under development and all the nice improvements it was going to do, but at the same time my mind kinda wandered  around if there were any 0.x releases coming out and if i do make any contributions should i make some sort of compromise and make a version of any designs  for 0.x and one for  OA3? Or only solely for one and not the other or only for the current released build? (I essentially overthought the entire situation)  And then after your response and some digging into the forums and seeing points of views  some devs had as to why, i understood that it's now full speed ahead to Open Arena 3! I guess I more or less have an idea now of where to start now and what steps to take for some things like fan skins  for some existing characters like an addon file or something from ModDb where it's more or less an optional and unofficial thing, and that the list on the wiki was more or less suggestions instead of mandatory character designs that need implementing

Thanks again for the help Smiley




1) I consider the wiki unofficial and only useful for information/guide purposes only.   Creative direction happens off-site (and usually in a private forum where it'll be ignored by those with access to it anyway).

Currently the OA3 cast is a bunch of my own designs (dark elves, lamias etc) plus select Arne's designs contributed from this thread which helped my creative block massively.  Then I model/texture them, and attempt to animate them (since animating a player model is a very lost art) in which no one helps at all and they rot on my hard drive until i'm ready.  I also have to try and find the spare time and motivation for doing this.

2) Not always a guarantee.  Many of the redesigns are hugely technical (i.e. one 24-bit texture surface) and conform to a new art direction which will need their proportions exaggerated and their skin detail somewhat simplified (no grainy bits etc) and conforming to the split model standard, so no more Angelyss  entire-figure-is-a-lower-model-for-the-slingshot-bikini-to-not-be-broken-and-jiggle-physics trick etc.

3) It's usually just me filtering the designs out by laying concepts out on some grid and seeing if something sticks out.  OA3's general inspiration is high fantasy / tech mix, akin to Phantasy Star, which I feel isn't done in FPSes much and would compliment the fast gameplay the most and brings the most varied of map themes (and sense).

Of course, you can try to make your own character and, after it's fully completed and tested, ask for its inclusion through the SVN commits thread... it will be Fromhell, the project leader, to decide.

Don't mislead into futile development.  I don't even have a SVN client installed for years anymore given how creatively dried up the scene is...

Greetings fromhell and many thanks for the detailed reply!

I remember the first time  reading about Arne's post a month ago when i was still tinkering  with the idea of contributing designs [ and after i have the proper gear and knowledge/experience, help out with 3D modeling and maybe even coding/technical part of things Smiley  ] and it was that very post with all the redux character &weapon designs and the sight of seeing one of those designs come to life that inspired me to make my first step by signing up and getting familiar with the things here!

1) i did remember bumping into some links on both the wiki and somewhere here in the forums that say that they were private like some of the example concepts on the Wiki that shows what some people came up with so far for OA 3 (though i do understand that it defeats the purpose of surprising the community with the new content or keeping the forums from kinda overflowing with either an endless stream of  suggestions or requests  or dare i say it any hostilities if everyone immediately knew  what was going on ^_^;  )

2)I actually never considered the technical side of 3D modeling for game development before and how any choices in formats or actual model rendering and what not can adversely affect the game itself until i read your reply to my second question... I guess i have a great amount to study and brush up on with the engine and tools before i even consider making a design suggestion so it won't take up everyone else extra time if ever anything i work on  does get approved

3) I was kinda confused  without too much a reference on the wiki when it said OA3 was going to be anime-ish in design and needed a consistent art style because that could've meant or looked like anything... But now that you mention Phantasy Star (i have played a good amount of it while i was in high school) i now more or less have a solid example of what's being looked for ! (i'm still going to have to slowly work my way up from the beginning, for respect is not automatically or merely offered by everyone, but earned... That and in contributing, i must find a way to merge the themes you are looking for in such a way that it's pleasant and colorful and unique like Phantasy Star without unwittingly mimicking the designs too closely for things to accidentally get into copyrighted territory ^_^; )

 Overall, thank you for the help and clarifications! I hope to one day be useful here one way or another or in the very least maybe look for others willing and ready to help with development? Either way, thanks Smiley
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Gig
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« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2018, 03:46:51 am »

I just did a quick fix to that wiki page trying to clarify what's that page today: http://openarena.wikia.com/index.php?title=Character_ideas&diff=18557&oldid=17962
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ELR1C_C150utcast
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« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2018, 08:08:48 am »

I just did a quick fix to that wiki page trying to clarify what's that page today: http://openarena.wikia.com/index.php?title=Character_ideas&diff=18557&oldid=17962

Roger that! I checked the wiki a while ago and the edits make the description much clearer now Smiley I'll take both your and FromHell's advice with regards to that list to use  as a guide or source of  inspiration for character design proposals. (In fact, one of  the designs i'm working on at the moment , though still very WIP and one i'm ready to iterate on, was inspired by one of the pitches on that list! I'm also bearing in mind that i have to keep with the more Anime high fantasy look as perscribed by FromHell) Many thanks Gig !
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