Is mapping layouts all trial and error?

[fromhell]

Often I see well graded maps that don't play well but are graded high for either use of a texture pack or atmosphere, or just because it's from a big mapper and the review is a brownnose episode.  But this le - what's a bad layout and what's a good one?

I want to know so I can study good layouts that work well, particularily CTF layouts. I do want to map again, but my maps always look terribly blocky or play bad or both... even if a good layout's done it'll be ripped apart for not looking good, but if it looks good it'll be ripped apart for high r_speeds...

[sago007]

I once read that in most CTF maps most battle take place in the bases and the surrounding are just something to run by. That is a bit discouraging so I always try to make all the routes cross in the middle, so you have a realistic change of intercepting the flag carrier.

Traps are hated in CTF, this includes any kind of lava and void.

There should be more entrances to the bases. 3 or more.

Some things I consider important to keep in mind: Imagine playing the map without strafejumping at all... is it still playable? Can I read the flag in a reasonable time without jumping at all (excluding jumppads)? Are there multiple paths that does not require jumping?

Basically: Does the map work on its own or is it just the way I play it that makes it fun.

I have my own preference for limited armor and lots of guns... to get more kills and make the map more fun. But not all people agrees with me on that.

Some changes will always be required. The limited number of testers on maps are a problem. Problems with weapon balance will usually not be discovered until the map goes live.

[pulchr]

layout is not all trial and error - of course not. but it can often be very difficult to get it right even if you plan ahead. after some experience you'll be able to 'feel' what's right when it comes to many factors - but it really helps with early testing by REAL players.

a couple of things to think of can be found below. not all of these ideas apply to ctf-maps though:

Lunaran's Deathmatch Encyclopedia

level design patterns

[cosmo]

Mapping is like most other things (creating a model in blender, drawing a picture, writing good code, ...).
You'll develop a feeling for a few things that might work.

In the beginning nearly everybody does bad things regarding to proportions (wall thickness, ledge and stair steepness, roomsize).

I encounter myself pretty often to find a few aspects of a map good and the rest is not working good enough.

Reading a few articles what other found and what's not so obvious might help though.

[Thoushaltdie]

i'll be a tester if you need ppl