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Author Topic: Importing or recreating maps from Elite Force?  (Read 13844 times)
G-Max
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« on: September 11, 2009, 11:24:28 AM »

Is anyone up to it? I'd mostly be interested in Beta Station, Delta Station, and Boarding Party...

Also, would anyone be up for importing/recreating maps from Jedi Outcast or Jedi Academy? MOHAA? CoD/CoD2? Return to Wolfenstein?

You must admit that would be awesome.
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dbX
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« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2009, 12:38:53 PM »

It would be awesome. However, importing maps from commercial games is a no-go unless you want to get sued. Recreating them might be possible but am not sure. I'd rather be creating than recreating.

Other than that, some of the games you listed have very different styles than OA (CoD for example) and maps from these games would not fit well into OA.
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fromhell
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« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2009, 10:53:46 PM »

big no
importing is dirty. OA is not a scavenge-the-non-Free project.
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G-Max
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« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2009, 04:54:57 PM »

Other than that, some of the games you listed have very different styles than OA (CoD for example) and maps from these games would not fit well into OA.

Yeah, I haven't played multi in any of those games except Elite Force.

importing is dirty. OA is not a scavenge-the-non-Free project.

But as for re-creating...?
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G-Max
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« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2009, 12:01:07 AM »

And for the record, do you seriously expect me to believe that wrackdm17, AKA "never ending yard", is not a copy of q3dm17, AKA "the longest yard"? Or that the weapons in OA are not based on those in Q3A?

Quote
OA is not a scavenge-the-non-Free project.

Fixed.
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fromhell
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« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2009, 12:16:30 AM »

Did I copy q3dm17.bsp and rename it to wrackdm17.bsp? Did I copy .md3 files and swap textures?
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I do not provide technical support either.

new code development on github
Graion Dilach
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« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2009, 09:04:00 AM »

But as for re-creating...?

Did you tried to search an answer for this question?  OpenArena does allow recreations, like wrackdm17 (I don't understand why every second space map must be based upon q3dm17, 19 is much better BTW) although the next release won't keep the Quake 3 recreations, just as a possible addition.

Recreations from other games are possible, considering that sometimes the map's original style not very fits into OA, and maybe it'll need a style change.
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Falkland
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« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2009, 02:05:04 PM »

And for the record, do you seriously expect me to believe that wrackdm17, AKA "never ending yard", is not a copy of q3dm17, AKA "the longest yard"? Or that the weapons in OA are not based on those in Q3A?

It's not exactly a copy and it's not a reverse engeneering work ( geometry is different ) , even if the layout , the name and some items' placements ( rg , sg , mh , quad are placed in the same position ) , all remember q3dm17.

For example the railgun platform is lower than in q3dm17 and railgun camping is not so easy as in q3dm17.

Anyway the original q3dm17 is much more playable (IMHO) because the compact geometry makes most of the map reachable with any jumper+strafe combination while that's not always possible in wrackdm17.
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G-Max
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« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2009, 12:35:01 AM »

This is all epically hilarious.

"Copying stuff from other games, like Q3A, is bad"

"We're trying to be as close to Q3A as possible" (different thread)

"It's not at all like the map in Q3A because we moved the railgun platform a little bit downward and got rid of trick-jumping. That makes it totally different."

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chaoticsoldier
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« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2009, 04:55:40 AM »

Where are those quotes from and in what context were they used?
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dbX
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« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2009, 07:23:44 AM »

OA is a free(as in freedom) recreation of Quake 3 Arena, not of Elite Force and most certainly not of MOHAA or CoD  or Counter-Strike (I don't even know how you got the idea that maps from games based on WWII would even fit into a game based on fiction). OA does have imported and modified maps which are also free(as in freedom) and they fit along the style of OA. OA does not have any maps imported or recreated from commercial games.

Quote
"Copying stuff from other games, like Q3A, is bad"
You can use maps as long as they are free(as in freedom). It is bad to use maps that are non-free or from commercial games because of legal reasons.
Quote
"We're trying to be as close to Q3A as possible" (different thread)
OA does tend to look like Q3A and has the Q3A style, but is not an identical clone as a lot of the content was created(not recreated), and hopefully with time OA will contain a lot of original and unique content and art.
Quote
"It's not at all like the map in Q3A because we moved the railgun platform a little bit downward and got rid of trick-jumping. That makes it totally different."
You got a point there. The map is the one in Q3A, but was modified. But that does not mean that people who work on OA put anything they find on the internet into OA.

If you want you can re-create a map, with the following things in mind: the original map must be free(as in freedom, in OA this means GPLv2), the style must fit with OA, and the map must be fun (a 4-wall frag-festing spawn-camping crap-fests are not very desireable).

Oh, and BTW I think you misinterpreted what fromhell said:
Quote
OA is not a scavenge-the-non-Free project.
Notice it says non-Free. This means that maps like wrackdm17 are welcome(as they are freely licendes under GNU GPLv2). All the games you mentioned are commercial games(non-free) and importing maps from them would be bad.

As for recreating maps from commercial games that is possible, but you have to create the map from scratch (you cannot use the original maps as those are non-free) and you have to make sure that the map fits into OA style. I can't think of a single map from CoD that would fit well into OA. I know because I've played all the games you listed.
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Logan
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« Reply #11 on: September 17, 2009, 11:15:39 PM »

And for the record, do you seriously expect me to believe that wrackdm17, AKA "never ending yard", is not a copy of q3dm17, AKA "the longest yard"?

Have you ever even played The longest yard from quake 3 or quake live?
wrackdm17 is a re creation. Absolutly. There are many major and minor details between the two besides textures. The longest yard is much bigger than wrackdm17 for example.

Edit: See also what Falkland said.

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G-Max
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« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2009, 11:46:39 AM »

Since when has OA had a distinct style?

Quake 3 Arena, not of Elite Force and most certainly not of MOHAA or CoD  or Counter-Strike

Counter-strike? Who said anything about Counter-strike? Why the hell are you bringing Counter-strike into this? Is Counter-strike based on id Tech 3?
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dbX
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« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2009, 01:41:04 PM »

Since when has OA had a distinct style?

Quake 3 Arena, not of Elite Force and most certainly not of MOHAA or CoD  or Counter-Strike

Counter-strike? Who said anything about Counter-strike? Why the hell are you bringing Counter-strike into this? Is Counter-strike based on id Tech 3?

Well, OA may not have a distinct style but it's at least obvious that it's not Star Trek (Elite Force, though this could fit with OA with some modifications to maps), nor WWII (CoD, MoHAA).

I also listed Counter-Strike as you mentioned adding models of real weapons to OA in another thread http://openarena.ws/board/index.php?topic=3318.0. This is also a bad idea because adding a real weapon would clash with the rest of the game which is unrealistic, just as a map from CoD would clash with other maps.
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jackoverfull
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« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2009, 03:06:58 PM »

raven released the source for some of these maps (eg: the beatiful geothermal), so importing them is technically possible (indeed, i imported and retextured geothermal a couple of years ago), but the license of these sources is not clear at all, so i'm not sure that a converted map would even be distributable.
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fromhell
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« Reply #15 on: September 26, 2009, 05:50:35 AM »

The source for their maps (As well as q3's) included with editing kits to demonstrate examples are not Free, and should be avoided.
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asking when OA3 will be done won't get OA3 done.
Progress of OA3 currently occurs behind closed doors alone

I do not provide technical support either.

new code development on github
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